Issues with 2018 GPS/Navi

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  • Issues with 2018 GPS/Navi

    I thought it might be a good idea to start a thread to document all of the issues with the new GPS Navigation system on the 2018. I can see to it that this thread makes it way to Honda in Japan, so please add any comments or observations of your own.


    1. Can't have a starting point in a route different from your current location - On the previous (Garmin) GPS, if you were not at your starting point in a route, the GPS would display a screen offering you the opportunity to ride to the starting point, or begin the route from your current location. It had the intelligence to re-calculate your route based on your current coordinates.

    2. No waypoint names supported. Even though the Honda Trip Planner website allows you to "rename" waypoints in a route, the GPS does not utilize these names, and they ARE part of the GPX file (see below). This is a really huge shortcoming of this GPS.

    3. Imported destination address are not interpreted correctly. One three different imports from the Honda Trip Planner website the GPS mis-read the final destination address. This could be some sort of flaw in the GPS coordinates interpretation routine within the GPS itself. I think what it may be doing is only looking at the Lattitude/Longitude of the GPX file (see below in red), then it is mis-calculating the final destination and re-writing the address accordingly.

    See post #2 for some updated findings - This is an issue with the GPX files create from Honda Trip Planner

    4. Find destination by intersection is totally useless. In a large city, you basically have to know the zip code of the intersection before the GPS can locate the intersection. For example, if I try to locate the intersection of Walnut Hill Ln and Marsh Ln in Dallas, Texas, the GPS will ask me for the zip code FIRST.

    5. POIs are not saved between sessions. https://youtu.be/YbklN70fjgY. There is no way to select POI preferences and get them to "save". Also, POI icons do not show up on the map as you ride past them.

    6. Voice commands do not speak "drive" or "lane" instead of DR or LN. When the GPS gives audio directions, it does not use words like "lane" or "drive".

    7. 8 Waypoint-per-route limitation - Self explanatory. I am not sure if there was any limitation on the 2012 model.

    8. Inferior map display on-screen. Often the map display is zoomed out so far as to be useless information.

    9. No way to invoke audio instructions (previous model you could push Zoom). On the previous GPS, you could invoke audio instructions for the next action in a route. For example, pressing the zoom button on the left hand control would instruct the GPS to announce "in 3 miles, take exit 121 toward Dallas".

    10. NEW! GPS Maps are either out of date or inaccurate. I had a Facebook friend, and VERY knowledgeable rider point out that addresses he has entered directly into the GPS unit show as being "off route", even though the address is at least two years old. I had a similar experience that I will try to duplicate in my next video. When I tried to set my home address up as the HOME location on the GPS, the incorrect address shows up. I am not sure if the maps are out of date, or if the internal GPS is using rounded Longitude and Lattitude numbers (not as accurate).

    11. Setting HOME destination is non-intuitive. And, that is being generous. The only way I have figured out how to set the HOME destination is to ride to a different location, Set my home address as the destination, then ROUTE to it using GO. After arrival, I can use the Previous Destinations screen from which to select my home address as the HOME destination.

    12. Audio navigation not working after stop/restart. I have had several owners report an issue when on a route, then they stop the bike, say to get gas. when they restart the bike, and navigation re-assumes the route, the audio navigation goes away. So, it appears to be a bug that when the NAVI is turned OFF, then back ON, even though it will resume the route, the audio navigation is no more. You can cancel the route, and restart the route, and audio will come back. However, if you start a route it will ALWAYS want to take back to the starting waypoint. It cannot recognize where you are on the route and re-calculate accordingly. BIG problem.


    That's TWELVE issues that DID NOT EXIST with the 2011 technology on the 2012 Goldwing GPS.I am pretty sure than most Gold Wing owners expected the technology and features to advance over the last 7 years, not decline and go backwards.


    GPX FILE

    The GPX file is basically an XML structure that communications information for GPS units. Below is an example of a GPX waypoint record:

    <wpt lat="32.401708765" lon="-98.793722754">
    <time>2016-09-13T19:11:40Z</time>
    <name>Eastland Fuel</name>
    <cmt>1424 E Main St Eastland, TX, 76448, USA</cmt>
    <desc>1424 E Main St Eastland, TX, 76448, USA</desc>
    <sym>Gas Station</sym>
    <extensions>
    <gpxx:WaypointExtension xmlns:gpxx="http://www.garmin.com/xmlschemas/GpxExtensions/v3">
    <gpxx:DisplayMode>SymbolAndName</gpxx:DisplayMode>
    <gpxx:Address>
    <gpxx:StreetAddress>1424 E Main St</gpxx:StreetAddress>
    <gpxx:City>Eastland</gpxx:City>
    <gpxx:State>TX</gpxx:State>
    <gpxx:Country>USA</gpxx:Country>
    <gpxx:PostalCode>76448</gpxx:PostalCode>
    </gpxx:Address>
    </gpxx:WaypointExtension>
    </extensions>
    </wpt>

    As you can see from the example above, the <name> field exists in the GPX file, yet the 2018 Harman GPS ignores this information and does not display it on the screen, or in the audio commands.

    Click image for larger version  Name:	20180317_080320.jpg Views:	2 Size:	324.9 KB ID:	93192
    Last edited by Cruiseman; 05-20-2018, 07:06 PM.
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  • #2
    I just made another interesting discovery. The issue with Imported Destination Address not being correctly interpreted could be related to the Honda Trip Planner. Apparently, the Honda Trip Planner exports a completely different form of GPX file than does a BaseCamp export run through GPSBabel.

    The example GPX record show in my original post above came from a BaseCamp export that had been "cleaned" using GPSBabel software.

    Below is a GPS record exported directly from the Honda Trip Planner website:

    <rtept lat="32.4017088" lon="-98.7937228">
    <name>Eastland Fuel</name>

    As you can see, it is very sparse, only the longitude and lattitude and even that is not as granular (numbers are rounded up by two digits).

    lat="32.401708765" in BaseCamp/GPS Babel
    lat="32.4017088" in Honda Trip Planner

    This lack of granularity could be the reason the addresses on the motorcycle GPS are incorrect after import. Those extra two digits are there for a reason and most likely represent the actual street address location.

    I ran another test by running a BaseCamp GPX file through GPS Babel, then importing into the 2018 GPS. The destination address DID SHOW CORRECTLY using that method.

    So, there are issues with the Honda Trip Planner as well as the 2018 GPS.


    Last edited by Cruiseman; 03-19-2018, 08:50 AM.
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    • workhorse
      workhorse commented
      Editing a comment
      How far does the loss of 2 decimal places (8th and 9th) of resolution on both lat and lon equate to in actual distance (inches, feet, yards, blocks, miles, etc.) ?

    • SF49er
      SF49er commented
      Editing a comment
      The distance in longitude is dependent on the latitude, so this is relative to the equator. (The further north you go, the less distance between degrees.) A quick check with my calculator shows .00001°=3.64 ft. Take it to the 8th or 9th decimal place and you have a length impossible to measure without a precision laser (we're talking Angstroms here). Any precision beyond that is effectively meaningless.

  • #3
    On a topo map, an 8 digit grid co-ordinate gives a precise location, where a 6 digit grid is a general location. So, yeah, makes since that the more numbers given is a smaller area and more precise. ie... an entire block, compared to narrowing it down to a house.

    Comment: (For off-topic replies)


    • #4
      Post 1 example...everything between <extensions> and </extensions> are Garmin-specific instructions, and are not part of the official GPS Exchange format:

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GPS_Exchange_Format

      If <name>whatever</name> is NOT being interpreted/displayed by the new GPS, that's a problem - it's supposed to be!
      Ken (IBA #50030) & Grace (IBA #62768)Tucson, AZ"Get busy living, or get busy dying." -Andy Dufresne, The Shawshank Redemption 1994ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕMy blog

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      • #5
        I was also intrigued by the GPSBabel video that allowed a person in TX to Set Destination (successfully) for a route in CA. While I, who had used the Honda Trip Planner to do something similar [I'm in NC] and attempting to Set Destination for a CA route found the GPS to hang up. When I get my bike, I intend to use GPSBabel to export my Basecamp routes. But, until Honda addresses the above list, I may simply be rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic. BTW: thanks for the list, as I had intended to do a similar summary to discuss with the local dealer and hopefully the Honda rep.
        2018 red GL1800 DCT Tour w/ 2019 CSC Encore
        2003 red GL1800A w/ 2013 CSC Cobra XL

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        • #6
          So my question is, if you don’t want to import a whole route, but just put in a destination address, will the GPS take you there, or does it change like it did in your route import?

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          • #7
            Originally posted by Raymond Yillik View Post
            So my question is, if you don’t want to import a whole route, but just put in a destination address, will the GPS take you there, or does it change like it did in your route import?
            If you input the address directly into the GPS unit, it will take you to that exact address. The change (I think) came from the import of a destination from Honda Trip Planner website.
            Last edited by Cruiseman; 03-20-2018, 05:11 AM.
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            • #8
              I just had a call from Honda America A few notes.

              First I was able to verify the weather radar is supposed to be displayed on the gps map if you have XM with weather.

              I then went down the list of issues that you have listed Cruiseman as well as others we’ve discussed on this forum. I could hear typewriter clicking as he took the notes. I also reinterated that these flaws needed to be addressed by summer riding season and that many of these same flaws were corrected on HD version of the HK gps. Hopefully this will move up the Honda hierarchy. We’ll see.

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              • #9
                Originally posted by MajorThom View Post
                I just had a call from Honda America A few notes.

                First I was able to verify the weather radar is supposed to be displayed on the gps map if you have XM with weather.

                I then went down the list of issues that you have listed Cruiseman as well as others we’ve discussed on this forum. I could hear typewriter clicking as he took the notes. I also reinterated that these flaws needed to be addressed by summer riding season and that many of these same flaws were corrected on HD version of the HK gps. Hopefully this will move up the Honda hierarchy. We’ll see.
                Good job!
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                • #10
                  In the meantime, I was wondering if anyone might be working on a harness to connect the Garmin 595LM into the 2018 CanBus and audio system. I wonder if the audio system is even expandable?
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                  • #11
                    Originally posted by Cruiseman View Post
                    In the meantime, I was wondering if anyone might be working on a harness to connect the Garmin 595LM into the 2018 CanBus and audio system. I wonder if the audio system is even expandable?
                    I’m not at home, but when you cycle through the inputs for the sound system does auxiliary show up? In the Harley there was a spot that you could get a connector where you could install a Garman. I did that when the Harman was so miserable at first. I only used it on one trip because by the next spring when we went on the next trip they had it hammered out

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                    • #12
                      Originally posted by MajorThom View Post

                      I’m not at home, but when you cycle through the inputs for the sound system does auxiliary show up? In the Harley there was a spot that you could get a connector where you could install a Garman. I did that when the Harman was so miserable at first. I only used it on one trip because by the next spring when we went on the next trip they had it hammered out
                      Did the Harley GPS have this many issues?
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                      • #13
                        Originally posted by Cruiseman View Post

                        Did the Harley GPS have this many issues?
                        At first there were many. Maybe not quite this many, but within a few months they made several updates. I don't remember the online planning software and the bike not playing together like this. Hopefully, Honda/HK will get some meaningful updates out

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                        • #14
                          Originally posted by Cruiseman View Post
                          I just made another interesting discovery. The issue with Imported Destination Address not being correctly interpreted could be related to the Honda Trip Planner. Apparently, the Honda Trip Planner exports a completely different form of GPX file than does a BaseCamp export run through GPSBabel.

                          The example GPX record show in my original post above came from a BaseCamp export that had been "cleaned" using GPSBabel software.

                          Below is a GPS record exported directly from the Honda Trip Planner website:

                          <rtept lat="32.4017088" lon="-98.7937228">
                          <name>Eastland Fuel</name>

                          As you can see, it is very sparse, only the longitude and lattitude and even that is not as granular (numbers are rounded up by two digits).

                          lat="32.401708765" in BaseCamp/GPS Babel
                          lat="32.4017088" in Honda Trip Planner

                          This lack of granularity could be the reason the addresses on the motorcycle GPS are incorrect after import. Those extra two digits are there for a reason and most likely represent the actual street address location.

                          I ran another test by running a BaseCamp GPX file through GPS Babel, then importing into the 2018 GPS. The destination address DID SHOW CORRECTLY using that method.

                          So, there are issues with the Honda Trip Planner as well as the 2018 GPS.

                          You may need to do a tutorial on GPS Babel. I used it years ago with my first Garmin, but don't remember if I still remember how to use it. It's even been a long time since I used BaseCamp.

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                          • #15
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                            • workhorse
                              workhorse commented
                              Editing a comment
                              Nice debugging. Time to file a software bug report into their issue tracking database.

                          • #16
                            Originally posted by Cruiseman View Post
                            You sir, are a stud. Thank you so much for that refresher. I had used both of those programs but it was years ago. And it all came back when you started doing that and explained it you’re an excellent teacher.

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                            • #17
                              Originally posted by Cruiseman View Post
                              In the meantime, I was wondering if anyone might be working on a harness to connect the Garmin 595LM into the 2018 CanBus and audio system. I wonder if the audio system is even expandable?
                              Not required, with the bleu tooth function you can connect directly to the helmet. The Bleu Tooth will suppress any audio from bike radio when instuction is coming in from GPS or Phonecall (if Phone is connected directly to bleu tooth). I have this set-up currently on my 2013 and will do the same with my 2018 and will transfer my Zumo as again the Honda integrated is not adequate for my type of touring.
                              Harry, winger since 1979
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                              • Cruiseman
                                Cruiseman commented
                                Editing a comment
                                I was thinking more for power than for audio connectivity.

                            • #18
                              The more I research this GPS on the 2018 Gold Wing the stupider I feel. Either I am a complete idiot, or this is the most non-intuitive GPS interface I have used. I have tried 3 times to get the GPS to reset my HOME location. Maybe the manual is just poorly written.

                              The same is true for trying to store a Favorite in the favorites list.

                              I might be stupid, but I never had ANY of these issues with a Garmin GPS. Color me frustrated.

                              The manual says to:
                              1. Select a search method and find a location that you want to store. 2 P. 44
                              2. Press and hold (Enter) on the center panel or ENT switch on the left handlebar while the location is selected.




                              However, after I search (using search by address) for a location, my only option is to GO to that location. I guess I don't know what the manual is referring to by "while the location is selected" because after I enter the street number, and press ENTER, the GPS sets that as the destination.

                              I can select an address from the PREVIOUS Destinations list, hold the ENTER key down and THEN choose Set to Home or Save to Favorite. But that is the only place I have been able to get that screen to appear.
                              Last edited by Cruiseman; 03-21-2018, 08:31 AM.
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                              • #19
                                I stopped using the manual and just "fiddle" with it until I accidentally get it to do what I want. Lol

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                                • #20
                                  Originally posted by JHawk8 View Post
                                  I stopped using the manual and just "fiddle" with it until I accidentally get it to do what I want. Lol
                                  Well then, fiddle around and see if you can figure out how to save a favorite OTHER THAN from the Previous Destinations list. I have been trying for over an hour.
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