Australians Rethinking Gun Control

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  • Australians Rethinking Gun Control

    Just one day after the tragedy in Sydney, Australians are now wishing they hadn't given up their guns so easily in their country-wide firearm confiscation. Australians are looking to America, and not the UK for guidance.

    “I’ll tell you this point blank: I’d feel safer in a country where I was legally allowed to carry around a firearm,” says J Coughran, 30, a Sydney businessman.

    “This ISIS stuff is seeing quite a few people changing their opinions. one of my mates told me today- he’s coming around on the gun issue. He’s 68 years old, been against guns his whole life- now he’s turning around because of these savages.”

    "It is times like these that Americans should thank God they have the Second Amendment, and crush any effort or force seeking to weaken or remove it." “Our lack of self-defense makes us a prime target. It is no surprise to me that home grown terrorism is most rampant in nations with strict gun control. These guys want to snatch random people in Australia off the street, drape them in the ISIS flag and behead them on camera with an Arabic-emblazoned sword. If I had a gun, I’ll tell you what I’d do with those swords.”

    Source

  • #2
    Are you sure?
    Do you really believe that the opinion of a 30 year old business man in a country of 23+ million is reflective the entire country? 1: 23,000,000
    Many would suggest that timing of such a comment should be considered as nothing more than one persons 'knee jerk reaction" to a recently publicized occurrence.

    BBC World news, and Australian News 9news.com.au or the NSW News, or any of the Sydney news channels mention any such claims.

    You are more likely to have just as many people claim , and actually believe, the offender was possessed by a 'demon'.

    Comment: (For off-topic replies)


    • #3
      Originally posted by pearlblue1800 View Post
      Are you sure?
      Do you really believe that the opinion of a 30 year old business man in a country of 23+ million is reflective the entire country? 1: 23,000,000
      Many would suggest that timing of such a comment should be considered as nothing more than one persons 'knee jerk reaction" to a recently publicized occurrence.

      BBC World news, and Australian News 9news.com.au or the NSW News, or any of the Sydney news channels mention any such claims.

      You are more likely to have just as many people claim , and actually believe, the offender was possessed by a 'demon'.
      And it doesn't really matter how many of the 23+ million would like to change the country's firearm policies. If the folks in the government are still against it, nothing will happen.
      Case in point. The Affordable Care Act.

      However, I do agree that I feel safer living where I have the right to and can carry the necessary equipment to defend myself and my family.

      Comment: (For off-topic replies)


      • #4
        Every idea starts with one person. If enough people start to feel the same way, things will change.

        Comment: (For off-topic replies)


        • #5
          Originally posted by wingleader09 View Post
          ..."It is times like these that Americans should thank God they have the Second Amendment, and crush any effort or force seeking to weaken or remove it." “Our lack of self-defense makes us a prime target. It is no surprise to me that home grown terrorism is most rampant in nations with strict gun control. These guys want to snatch random people in Australia off the street, drape them in the ISIS flag and behead them on camera with an Arabic-emblazoned sword. If I had a gun, I’ll tell you what I’d do with those swords.”

          Source
          So well said. Thanks Jim.
          Richard
          Darksider #390
          Murgie's FAQ

          Comment: (For off-topic replies)


          • #6
            It's widely understood - except by leftists who worship government - that thugs and would-be burglars, robbers, rapists, and other human debris think twice before going into neighborhoods and communities where residents are likely to own guns. Even criminals understand that concept.
            Harvey Barlow
            Crosby County, TX
            2010 Goldwing Level II Pearl Yellow (sold at 93,000 miles)
            2014 Goldwing Level II Pearl Blue (sold at 27,000 miles to forum member)

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            • #7
              Originally posted by jmohme View Post


              However, I do agree that I feel safer living where I have the right to and can carry the necessary equipment to defend myself and my family.

              Would it not be more reasonable to not live in an area where you feel that you must carry a firearm to defend yourself and family?
              Living somewhere or anywhere, which causes you to feel that owning of a firearm is a prerequisite or "necessary to feeling safe"?
              Would seem to suggest that there are many safer/better areas in which to reside.

              Comment: (For off-topic replies)


              • #8
                Originally posted by pearlblue1800 View Post


                Would it not be more reasonable to not live in an area where you feel that you must carry a firearm to defend yourself and family?
                Living somewhere or anywhere, which causes you to feel that owning of a firearm is a prerequisite or "necessary to feeling safe"?
                Would seem to suggest that there are many safer/better areas in which to reside.
                Tell me this, how well did those strict gun laws work yesterday in Australia? The only way to stop a bad man with a gun is by a good man with a gun.

                Comment: (For off-topic replies)


                • Kiwi
                  Kiwi commented
                  Editing a comment
                  " The only way to stop a bad man with a gun is by a good man with a gun" Dang. I thought that did happen.

              • #9
                Originally posted by pearlblue1800 View Post


                Would it not be more reasonable to not live in an area where you feel that you must carry a firearm to defend yourself and family?
                Living somewhere or anywhere, which causes you to feel that owning of a firearm is a prerequisite or "necessary to feeling safe"?
                Would seem to suggest that there are many safer/better areas in which to reside.
                Apparently you haven't been reading the news lately. Those "safe" areas are the areas being targeted, because the thugs know that's where they'll have fewer problems. There is no "crime-free" neighborhood, anywhere. Most of us will never have a problem or need a gun. Unfortunately, when some need it, they'll find they don't have one.

                I ride safely. I still wear a helmet. In my 45+ years of riding, I've never needed my helmet. I still wear it.
                2012 Honda Goldwing | 2009 Timeout Camper



                Patriot Guard Rider since 2007 | IBA member #59823

                Comment: (For off-topic replies)


                • #10
                  Originally posted by wingleader09 View Post

                  Tell me this, how well did those strict gun laws work yesterday in Australia? The only way to stop a bad man with a gun is by a good man with a gun.
                  This event became international news because of the rarity of the incident. When two hostages were murdered

                  How many multiple murders were committed in the USA yesterday?

                  Does the name Bradley Stone come to mind? It should.
                  An ex-military person who killed 6 relatives and attempted to kill three others (yesterday).

                  6 killings vs. 2

                  Just to show you the flawed thinking in your statement.

                  How did the liberal gun laws in many of the American states work yesterday for those 9 citizens?

                  Sadly the thousands of shootings each year within the USA seem not to bother some of the posters on this board.
                  Why? Perhaps because it is such routine or in some instances an everyday occurrence to read about shootings and murders.

                  However the news of firearm violence within America does not go unnoticed by the rest of the world.

                  2012 Homicide rates

                  Australia 254 1.1 per 100,000
                  Canada 545 1.6 per 100,000

                  U.S.A. 14,827 4.7 per 100,000

                  Comment: (For off-topic replies)


                  • #11
                    Originally posted by pearlblue1800 View Post

                    This is event became international news because of the rarity of the incident. When two hostages were murdered

                    How many multiple murders were committed in the USA yesterday?

                    Does the name Bradley Stone come to mind? It should.
                    An ex-military person who killed 6 relatives and attempted to kill three others (yesterday).

                    6 killings vs. 2

                    Just to show you the flawed thinking in your statement.

                    How did the liberal gun laws in many of the American states work yesterday for those 9 citizens?

                    Sadly the thousands of shootings each year within the USA seem not to bother some of the posters on this board.
                    Why? Perhaps because it is such routine or in some instances an everyday occurrence to read about shootings and murders.

                    However the news of firearm violence within America does not go unnoticed by the rest of the world.
                    One of the persons that Stone (according to the article, they believe it was him) accosted had a concealed carry permit holder. I suspect he found the "liberal gun laws" very much to his liking.

                    BTW, Stone was on probation at the time of the shooting, so his possession of the weapons was not legal. Some of the victims he killed were stabbed, so gun laws likely would not have made a difference in this case.

                    It's worth noting that New Zealand, a close neighbor to Australia, has very similar crime statistics, yet they have much more liberal gun laws.

                    "Just to show you the flawed thinking in your statement."
                    2012 Honda Goldwing | 2009 Timeout Camper



                    Patriot Guard Rider since 2007 | IBA member #59823

                    Comment: (For off-topic replies)


                    • #12
                      Yes there current Gun Law is working as designed - Only the Cops & and Criminals -will have Guns - GUN FREE ZONES are Now the new Killing fields - Boycott the Stores or places in America that subscribe to this thinking.
                      Whoever said money can’t buy happiness, never paid for a divorce


                      IBA # 40576

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                      • #13
                        Whether Stone was on probation or not, has nothing to do with his premeditated actions.
                        His actions are what is at issue. Are you suggesting or trying to blame the victims for not having a firearm on their possession may somehow prevented their murders?
                        If you are of the misconception that a firearm may not have been used in each murder somehow mitigates the actions?

                        Hint: it does not
                        A firearm was used in the attempted murder of the three individuals that so far are still alive!
                        .

                        I am merely pointing out that firearm violence in the USA is abhorrent.


                        BTW

                        Crime statistics for 2012 as reported by United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime

                        state that New Zealand reported 41 homicides which correlated to a rate of .09 per 100,000 which is over 6 times the homicide rate in the USA.

                        As an addendum:

                        The American media constantly feeds it's citizens a culture of perpetual fear. Look at some members that are of the belief they require a firearm to feel safe.
                        What sort of environment is this? I can state with first hand knowledge that the perception of the gun culture in America does influence how much of the World perceives this nation.
                        The media fueled fears are relentless. Whether it be invasions, ill conceived wars, fear the government will take away your guns or any other incident that may create control..
                        See the recent media controlled Ebola episode, before that the debt ceiling 'crises'.
                        The constant whining that the democratically elected leaders are incompetent.

                        This country is NOT the utopia that many believe it is. The unremitting violence should be a concern for everyone.
                        I do not agree that violence needs to be met with further violence.
                        Nor should those that profess to be 'christian'. - forgive and forget.

                        The culture of encouraging education, and not rewarding foolishness will bode much better lifestyle for everyone.

                        Comment: (For off-topic replies)


                        • #14
                          Originally posted by pearlblue1800 View Post
                          Whether Stone was on probation or not, has nothing to do with his premeditated actions.
                          His actions are what is at issue. Are you suggesting or trying to blame the victims for not having a firearm on their possession may somehow prevented their murders?
                          If you are of the misconception that a firearm may not have been used in each murder somehow mitigates the actions?

                          Hint: it does not
                          A firearm was used in the attempted murder of the three individuals that so far are still alive!
                          .

                          I am merely pointing out that firearm violence in the USA is abhorrent.


                          BTW

                          Crime statistics for 2012 as reported by United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime

                          state that New Zealand reported 41 homicides which correlated to a rate of .09 per 100,000 which is over 6 times the homicide rate in the USA.

                          As an addendum:

                          The American media constantly feeds it's citizens a culture of perpetual fear. Look at some members that are of the belief they require a firearm to feel safe.
                          What sort of environment is this? I can state with first hand knowledge that the perception of the gun culture in America does influence how much of the World perceives this nation.
                          The media fueled fears are relentless. Whether it be invasions, ill conceived wars, fear the government will take away your guns or any other incident that may create control..
                          See the recent media controlled Ebola episode, before that the debt ceiling 'crises'.
                          The constant whining that the democratically elected leaders are incompetent.

                          This country is NOT the utopia that many believe it is. The unremitting violence should be a concern for everyone.
                          I do not agree that violence needs to be met with further violence.
                          Nor should those that profess to be 'christian'. - forgive and forget.

                          The culture of encouraging education, and not rewarding foolishness will bode much better lifestyle for everyone.
                          Who in the world do you think you are to tell "those who profess to be Christian" what to do? Have you now become Christ? There is nothing in Scripture that forbids a Christian from protecting themselves.

                          As to the rest of the drivel, I made no such suggestion about who was at fault. You were the one that brought up "liberal gun laws". I merely pointed out that the man who committed this violence was obviously not deterred by any laws, and one (apparent) prospective victim was protected by the gun laws you seem to dismiss.

                          Yes, the US is a violent nation compared to some. Compared to others, it's pretty safe.

                          You continually equate carrying a gun to living in fear, and I will continue to call you out on this. You have no evidence to back that up. I will continue to use myself as an example. I don't "fear" falling off my bike, but I wear a helmet. I hope to never have to need it. Same with a gun, I have never had to use one, I don't ever think I will, but I don't want to find myself in the situation where I need it and don't have it. That's not fear, that's being prepared.

                          You seem to contradict yourself, claiming there is relentless fearmongering, while at the same time insisting we have unremitting violence. The purpose of carrying a gun is not to meet violence with violence, but rather to stop the initial violence from continuing.

                          Aren't you an immigrant to the US (I may be wrong on that, but I thought I remembered you saying you were from Canada)? If this country is so far from utopia, why did you choose it?
                          2012 Honda Goldwing | 2009 Timeout Camper



                          Patriot Guard Rider since 2007 | IBA member #59823

                          Comment: (For off-topic replies)


                          • #15
                            Originally posted by pearlblue1800 View Post
                            ...
                            Crime statistics for 2012 as reported by United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime

                            state that New Zealand reported 41 homicides which correlated to a rate of .09 per 100,000 which is over 6 times the homicide rate in the USA.
                            ...
                            I think you have your statistics turned around. The murder rate in NZ for 2012 was 1/6th that of the US. Not 6x.
                            2012 Honda Goldwing | 2009 Timeout Camper



                            Patriot Guard Rider since 2007 | IBA member #59823

                            Comment: (For off-topic replies)


                            • #16
                              Looks like a Winter Arizonian - here in Texas as with most in Arizona, we're packing the difference just in case. And the in case will protect the defenseless when and if stuff starts happening. I am a NRA instructor for conceal & carry here in Texas which is also a war zone as is Arizona along the border and further North, our citizens (US) would rather have a chance than to die. I also wear a helmet but am yet to bounce my head off something... but I could / its a no win scenerio to have a constructive conversation with most Canadians with this attitude, doesn't stop me from traveling there... and don't ask because I still carry there also.... just to bad the Canadians have jumped on the lefty band wagon.... you would just love Yomama the Pres and dictator !!!!

                              Location
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                              Retired, Lifetime NRA, IBA #5831, AMA Lifer, HOG Lifer, Gypsy Tour Rider

                              "There comes a time in your life, when you walk away from all the drama and people who create it. You surround yourself with people who make you laugh. Forget the bad, and focus on the good. Love the people who treat you right, pray for the ones who don't. Life is too short to be anything but happy. Falling down is a part of life, getting back up is living."

                              Comment: (For off-topic replies)


                              • #17
                                Mr. Solidbob:
                                I have not been able to locate any research that supports your claim than most of the residents of two southern states you mentioned carry firearms.
                                I have located the following figures are from 2012: 44% in Texas vs. 31% in Arizona, possess firearms. I am open to any error or correction(s) that you may present.

                                It is well known that both Texas and Arizona have some of the most lax control for the possession of firearms in the country.

                                Are you aware that for the third straight year gun deaths in Arizona have out numbered vehicle deaths?

                                http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank...ng-households/

                                http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/10/us...anted=all&_r=0

                                I am appalled that you would state on an internet forum that you willingly disobey the laws of any country.
                                Obviously you must be of the misbelief that you are immune to prosecution.
                                I suggest that you are terribly mistaken.

                                Here is an incident from Dec 02, 2014 that occurred when an American was caught bringing a firearm into Canada at the Osoyoos B.C. border crossing. Apparently he did not try to hide this fact which was a mitigating circumstance in his sentencing. Which in many instances the vehicle used in the offence is seized and forfeited to the Crown.

                                "Trying to sneak a loaded handgun into Canada has cost an American man both the firearm and a $10,000 fine.
                                A lawyer for Cole Reid Phillips, 21, pleaded guilty on his behalf Monday in provincial court in Penticton to the criminal offence of possession of a restricted weapon and the Customs Act offence of smuggling.
                                Court heard Phillips, a student from Phoenix, Ariz., was pulled aside for secondary inspection on July 21 while attempting to cross into Canada by car at Osoyoos.
                                Phillips told a Canada Border Services Agency officer he had ammunition in his vehicle, but not a gun, which raised suspicions, said Crown counsel Ashleigh Baylis.
                                The secondary inspection then turned up a loaded .45-calibre handgun and two magazines in the glove box of his car.
                                Baylis said Phillips later told CBSA officers that attitudes towards guns “are different in Arizona. It’s a different mentality.”
                                While Phillips faced a fine of up to $50,000 or six months in jail, Baylis suggested the minimal effort taken to hide the weapon was a mitigating factor for the judge to consider.
                                “It’s not a situation where he was driving a vehicle with a concealed department,” Baylis said, noting that Phillips nonetheless lied to officers at first.
                                Defence counsel Don Skogstad, who told the court his client wasn’t allowed into Canada to attend court, said Phillips was en route to Whistler for a hastily arranged mountain biking trip at the time and didn’t think to leave his gun at home.
                                In addition to the $10,00 fine imposed by Judge Greg Koturbash, Phillips is also liable for a $750 victim fine surcharge, bringing the total to $10,750.
                                When it announced his arrest in July, CBSA also noted Phillips was required to pay $1,500 for the return of his car, which was seized while he spent one night in custody while awaiting a bail hearing.
                                Skogstad said the $10,750 is being held in trust by his office and the fines will be paid in full." (He already paid the impound fee of $1,500)

                                Of course what is not included in the financial penalty are his legal fees.
                                A typical legal retainer for such an offence would be in the vicinity of $10,000. +

                                Comment: (For off-topic replies)


                                • #18
                                  Which does nothing to answer the question posed.... Why did you choose this violent, non-utopian country to flee to when you leave Canada?

                                  I'm curious - would you propose, in those states where automobile deaths outnumber gun deaths, that those states abolish possession of automobiles?

                                  Or, are you just selective as to which type of deaths are acceptable?
                                  2012 Honda Goldwing | 2009 Timeout Camper



                                  Patriot Guard Rider since 2007 | IBA member #59823

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                                  • #19
                                    Maybe rethink their immigration policy.
                                    "I ask, sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people, except for few public officials." (George Mason, 3 Elliot, Debates at 425-426)

                                    Comment: (For off-topic replies)


                                    • #20
                                      Leftists who are fond of pontificating about US gun laws and gun crimes and other subjects they don't understand never seem to notice that most of the US gun crimes are committed in cities and states where handguns are tightly controlled or prohibited and are committed by criminals who don't heed anyone's laws.

                                      If we could catch all our criminal element in the big city ghettos and release them in liberal paradises like Canada our gun crime rate would be drastically cut immediately and Canadian leftists would have the opportunity to prove the superiority of their gun laws.
                                      Harvey Barlow
                                      Crosby County, TX
                                      2010 Goldwing Level II Pearl Yellow (sold at 93,000 miles)
                                      2014 Goldwing Level II Pearl Blue (sold at 27,000 miles to forum member)

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